Fighting the Western media with love, for now?

Interesting point, if somebody, say your neighbor, publicly insulted and libeled your family, you would take the crap and respect his right of free speech, and it must be wrong for you to be offended, or you do not have the right to show your anger, do I get your point right?
PS : when I saw the Jack Cafferty's clip, I suddenly could visualize the "bitter" small-town xenophobic folks singled out by Barack Obama.

@Jerry:

Everyone has the right to defend themselves. But the question is really... should the Chinese government (note the link) be trying to defend itself against one comment by some Western guy on the television, who has probably never been to China and has no inkling of what this country is really like? By doing so, the government is stiring up nationalism. It's the same sense of nationalism that -- as was pointed out -- led to the racous protests outside the Japanese embassy in 2005. I'm just wondering how far down that same path we're headed at this point.

The palpable anger among Chinese Netizens over Jack Cafferty farce is spontaneous. I understand sometimes the commentators need be provocative, however, Jack Cafferty's remark can by no means be pigeonholed as something like that, it is pure venomous hatchet job.
Do you honestly think China government manipulate millions of brainwashed Netizens into venting their anger over a vicious assault of Chinese as a people? Really?

@Jerry:

Oh no. I'm not saying that this was a government-sponsored MSN campaign. If it were, it would be a lot more cumbersome! All I'm saying is that by responding to it, the government is using Cafferty's comments as a way to fire up some nationalistic feelings, and -- in a broader sense -- try to score some points against the media, and draw people's attention away from the negative PR that China has been getting recently. Oh, and by the way, Cafferty has clarified that he was talking about the Chinese government, and not the people. And they are not the same thing.

On the anti-Japanese nationalism issue, I would like to shed some light. I take it you know something about decades of war between China and Japan, however, do you know the japs colonized a large part of China, set up puppet governments and enslaved its people for decades, brutally killed more than 30 million Chinese? Nationalism helped China to survive the ordeal as a nation. You do not expect Chinese people to forget that so soon, do you? Should Chinese be so short-memoryed, we really do not deserve to exist as a nation. Japan used to be China's sworn enemy,and believe me,it won't be seen as anything near a friend for the foreseeable future.
Do you honestly believe only the government,not its people should be blamed for war crimes? why the indiscriminate strategic bombing of Germany and Japan in world war II？
When the successive democratically elected Japan governments vehemently keep denying Japan's war crimes and even try to whitewash its invasion as liberation, should we Chinese only be offended by
Japan's government?
If you really want to make a compelling point,
you had better look into the 2005 anti-Japanese events more closely, you need to ask yourself why
there was no anti-Brazil or anti-Italy backlash ?

According to my understanding, the remark by China's government speaker about Jack Cafferty was not a preemptive strike but rather a riposte when a AP journalist brought forward a question about China government's stand on that issue. What do you expect the speaker to say?
Do you think any speaker in his right mind would say " we respect Mr Cafferty's right of free speech
blah blah ?"
Sometimes it is better not to read too much into it.

@Jerry:

Two points: 1) Nationalism during a time of war is expected, and even warranted. But inciting nationalism during important times such as these, when the world's eyes are China, will only lead to a narrowing of opinions and the stifling of independent thought. Look what happened when Hitler keyed on the German people's sense of nationalism pre-World War II.

2)The question and answer sessions during the Foreign Ministry briefings are scripted, as reporters have to submit their questions in advance. As for what Jiang Yu should have said, I think you nailed it on the head. Jack Cafferty is paid to make noise. He's a blow-hard on CNN. And by the Chinese government acknoweledging that it paid attention to what he said speaks volumes about this government's concern about its image. The best thing Jiang Yu could have done was dismiss the comments out of hand, saying that they are irrelevant. But by floating out language like this gives the guy legitimacy:

"Cafferty used the microphone in his hands to slander China and the Chinese people, seriously violated professional ethics of journalism and human conscience", said Jiang.

What he did "reflected his arrogance, ignorance and hostility towards the Chinese people, ignited indignation of Chinese home and abroad, and will be condemned by those who safeguard justice around the world", said Jiang.

"We strongly demand CNN and Cafferty himself take back the vile remarks and apologize to all Chinese people," Jiang said.

First a general observation.

After taking stock of all the on-going expressions of righteous anger and indignation shown by a united “Chinese” people worldwide in reaction to recent “China/Chinese“ bashing, Western “pundits” and not a few “friends of China” are out to put their spin on this “shocking” turn of events.

This tsunami size backlash has aroused the “nationalism” in the “Chinese” people, they say. And, not being careful, more than a few “Chinese” writers have used the word “nationalism” as well.

Be careful! The word “nationalism” contains meanings of: excessive patriotism; chauvinism; the policy or doctrine of asserting the interests of one's own nation, viewed as separate from the interests of other nations or the common interests of all nations. In the West “nationalism” has been used traditionally to describe Nazi Germany, Japan during the run up to and through WWII. They are trying to put the same label on what is an genuine expression of “Chinese patriotism”. This is a much subtler form of demonizing “China/Chinese” and much more dangerous. “Yellow peril” comes to mind.

“Patriotism” has a simple meaning: devoted love, support, and defense of one's country; national loyalty.

To defend your country’s honor and territorial integrity is ‘patriotism” (pro-China/Chinese demonstrations).

To forcefully beat down other peoples through military might and to make them accept your political system is “nationalism” (Iraq).

Drop "nationalism".

@Jim Zhang:

I appreciate the point you are making, and I agree that we must always be careful with the language that we use (no one more so than the Chinese government). And while you're quite right to point out that there is most likely a broad sense of 'patriotism' connected to this, there is also a growing amount of 'nationalism' connected to this. Case in point. A laowai friend of mine is finding his relationship with his Chinese girlfriend strained because she is a fervent believer that there is some type of Western conspiracy afoot, and is transcribing her anger on her Western boyfriend. That, I would argue, is nationalism. Of course, this is a specific incident. However, I don't think I'm wrong in contending that as more and more is said about China in a negative way in the Western media, the more and more the Chinese are going to be connecting Westerners with their medium.

Now, I want to exercise my freedom of speech Cafferty style.

Paul, if you are a whitie Honkie trailer trash in China, you'd fit Agnes Smedly's description of a narrow minded, pig-eyed whitie who comes to China because he can't hold down a shoe salesman's job back home. You and you kind seem to flock to China again. I guess pigs can't change their grunts.

If you are a Chinese and have not looked in the mirror lately, you are a focking traitor. Under your thin layer of glibness, you are parroting hate for China/Chinese. Caffery is a bigot but he is in America, but you are a running dog of a bigot and in China. I don't see Cafferty nor you defending Rev. Wright's freedom of speech when he "damned America".

It's people like you I have trouble envisioning. Tell me, your mouth ...how many sides does it have?

Did Chris Patten ever get an apology from Beijing for being a called a "criminal" and 千古罪人?

F*ckin' hypocrites.

Paul,

Could you tell me if you are ready to defend David Irving's freedom of speech?

Chinese people really need to get over constantly putting themselves in the role of victims. Plenty of European countries were invaded by Germany in the 20th century. Plenty of Asian countries were invaded by Japan in the 20th century. But only China can't let it go... get over it.

@CC:

I'm presuming that you're talking about David Irving, the holocaust denier and author. If so, here's what I think about these people. They can write whatever the hell they want. They're idiots, and the world is very quick to expose them as such. I always equate this arguement about controvercial literature to someone suggesting that the bible be banned from print because you don't believe in its tenents. If it slanders or defames someone, let the courts sort it out.

Cafferty's "clarification" was awkward at best. First, the "Chinese government" consists of over 6 million officials -- that's more than the sum total of all ethnic Tibetans in this world, and by any measure still an unwise target for his "refined" insult. Second, no matter what he meant to say with his original comment, he need to apologize for it rather than simply "clarify", because considering his exact wording, the "interpretation" that he was referring to Chinese in general is fairly reasonable, so even in case there was a misunderstanding, he himself was the one to blame.

I've always liked Cafferty's straightforward and provocative style -- and I still do. But on the issue at hand, he really screwed up.

Another thing I find amusing is the -- at time cheerfully impatient -- anticipation by some Western observers for the nationalism in China to finally "explode".

Now, I'm not saying there's no nationalism in China. While being a native Chinese myself, I absolutely consider nationalism -- rather than simple patriotism -- to be overwhelmingly prevalent both inside China and among Chinese abroad, and personally I've always found it totally disgusting.

Still, the suggestion that the Chinese nationalism is on the brink of "exploding" sounds very far fetched to me. The anti-Japanese outburst a few years ago is mentioned a lot as an example, but I have to ask: What was the big deal there? Did those protests actually creating any noteworthy change of public opinion, let alone governmental policy? Apart from CCP fractions trying to manipulate the events for their infighting (I assume you know what I'm talking about), was there even the slightest danger of social destabilization?

I don't think so, and I don't think a shouting match between foreign protesters and Chinese angry youth at the Beijing Olympics -- a highly likely scenario, of course -- is going to a big deal either. That's not an "explosion", it's just barf.

Paul, you simply don't know a bit about China, its history, and its people. If Jiang Yu said as you suggested, it would be much more severely fueling Chinese people's anger.

I wouldn't bother to explain, you will never understand. But as basic respect to other people, don't act like you are Jesus himself, or "众人皆醉我独醒", and if you don't understand why hundreds of millions of people feel offended, it's more likely your problem than theirs.

wgj,

They are anticipating an "explosion" so they have big news to report on lol.

IMO the so called "nationalism" will never "explode" the way the west expected, and it's not true nationalism. It's patriotism plus political enthusiasm plus other emotions, really a mixed one. I like this dynamics within this generation of Chinese young people, they are surely a promising generation. It's also a good thing that the blind love to the western culture built up in the 70's and 80's (which has been passed to this generation by their parents) has gone to an end.

Paul,

Thanks for your reply. However, I don't think you actually answered my question: will you defend this man's freedom of speech regardless of what he says and your opinion about his view?

The reason I am pushing this issue for further discussion is that I have often heard people in the west saying the phrase of "freedom of speech" and "he/she is entitle to say his opinion" as if they are untouchable, divine rights.

However, I see a clear double standard here. A man was jailed for speaking out his opinion. There is apparently a limit with regard to the "freedom of speech".

The issue is where is the boundary? Who defines this boundary? The questions can be solved to a large extent in a domestic context(he was jailed because he broke the law). However, they become quite complicated when parties from different countries, cultures and religions, etc are involved. In these cases, IMHO, it boards ignorance and arrogance to simply use the magic word, "freedom of speech", to dismiss whatever reactions from other parties who may find the "freedom of speech" has gone too far.

Poor,oh,no,it's Paul,let me tell you some truth first of all.
If I don't tell you that you will never know it, then you will be a really poor guy.

All your imagination about "Chinese government" that just come from your personal experience, maybe you saw too much TV series and hollywood movies such as "24", "prison break", "The Manchurian Candidate" and so on.
But pay attention plz, that's "your government", not "Chinese government".
When chinese people see "your government drama", they always got surprised. What kind of people can be ruled by these kind of government who are so simple and naive who always supposed to control everything in the world but never really control anything infact, even they could never control themselves. But maybe these kind of government perfect match for western, so chinese people don't care of it, it's not our biz, WE NEVER TOUCH OTHER PEOPLE's JEWELRY AND WOMAN, coz we know we will pay for it that anything we got by evil way, that's why we can survive as a one-race nation in a sovereign country(infact Tibet are same race with Han) for a thousands years on the earth. Maybe your western don't know these or you don't care these, coz you thought you got benefit from invasion, colonize, slave trading, opium trading, world war and oil war. You know what, these happened just centuries, Judgment Day will come soon or late, that's your western's day, your people belive it that's not unreason, it depends on your western's history and your behavior in history. It's not our biz, you western people go to hell, just leave our chinese people alone, because we are innocent and you are guilty.

The second truth about Chinese people, that is all the chinese people have same ancestor, we are "Yan Han Zi Sun", we are family. So you western will never understand our chinese people, coz you don't know your ancestor, so you people treat each other just as people. Infact japanese, korean, vietnamese and most of southeast asian are all "Yan Han Zi Sun", their ancestor are all coming from mainland china. So the biz between china and japan is our biz, you western people will never understand. BTW. japan is a little girl, who was raped by your western, then became a bitch, but still she's our girl, we have duties to tell her what is right or wrong and make her be a fair lady.

The third truth about communism, that is chinese people never care about communism or any -ism from west, even chairman mao himself never really believe communism, we choice communism and communist party just because they can fight against you west criminal. So we can bear the sideeffect taken by communism and communist party, P.S. the idea from your west always have many sideeffect, that's why our chinese people never really believe your idea or suggestion, such as communism, democracy, freedom and so on. We have better world view that make our freedom not only on body but also in heart, and to get meaningful life but not just like an animal. But why we still bear communism, because we still need this animal to fight against another animal, untill one day the other animal was confined in cage, we will confined our animal in cage too.

Hi Paul,

My name is Patrick Searle, I'm from the China Ad Portal (www.china-adportal.com). I'd like to advertise on the Zhongnanhai blog.
If your interested or would just like to recieve more information please email me at publishers@china-adportal.com

Thanks,
Patrick

@ 赵破奴 ,

Oh baby, I loved your comment. I mean I really loved it.

I just hope, however, that ideas like that do not lead to WW3.

As Jack Nickolsen (spelled right?) said in Mars Attacks, "Why can't we all just get along?"

@赵破奴,

You poor, poor misguided sad thing. I truly feel sorry for you. Though I have to say I'm happy that the most meaningful thing you'll every do in your life is post deeply misguided rants on small-time blogs.

I'm Chinese and don't share your perspective, but I do value your right to express how you feel. Things aren't so binary--your inarticulate rant shows this so clearly.

Make sure when you mum feeds you next time, she sticks the spoon in your mouth, not the hole you usually talk out of.

Jerry, you wrote: "do you know the japs colonized a large part of China, set up puppet governments and enslaved its people for decades, brutally killed more than 30 million Chinese? Nationalism helped China to survive the ordeal as a nation."

Hmmm... we could re-write it this way: "do you know the Chinese colonized a large part of Tibet, set up a puppet government and enslaved its people for decades, brutally killed more than 1 million Tibetans (figure debatable)? Nationalism is helping Tibetans survive the ordeal as a nation."

@Balboa,

Yes, we can get along, infact we always repay injury with kindness, till nowaday we don't send our military to japan, though we have right to do this by the treatypact after WWII. But everytime we prepare to forget unhappy history, some trash just jumped out, such as some trashs acting in london and paris few days ago.

Oh, WW3, we almost met it in korean peninsula in 1950.
At that time we have no nuke, plane, tank, ship and any heavy weapon, so you country had thought that was unfair for us, then you signed a cease-fire agreement with us, you are such a gentleman, we really love your country. ;)

Today maybe your country or you people think we can make a fair play, so you want to dedicate WW3 or Cold War2 for us.

We will say:
Thank you, and you are welcome. :)

@赵破奴:
you do realize that a war with "the west" equals a war with NATO, right? Are you sure you want to fight 26+ countries at the same time?

At least you're going in the right direction, by making enemies out of the United States, and now entire western Europe.

@E,

Hahaha, Easy E :)

I'm just an ordinary chinese people, I can say anything that I'd like to say, if it will come to true what I said that is up to you people and your country.

Wow, 26+ countries, big numbers, during korean war, USA vamped up an army that was hired from some tens country, so-called the United Nations force, and jp, kor and some southeast asian countries support logistical, big numbers too, huh?!

Of course, "the west" not equals NATO.
Yugoslavia belongs west, northern European countries, Central and Eastern European countries are all belongs west.

Excuse me for my amateurish version on political terms.
Infact when I said "west" or "western", I just mean british, french and german.
And american are not pure western, if they lost their daddy, they will find another daddy.
So it's not big deal.

I am not British, I am not French, I am not German and I am not American. In fact I am from a north-western European country which so far has not been targeted by China's propaganda machine in overdrive. But perceptions of China here are also changing, for the worse. Or did you think the average European is going to be more positive about China after this? Like the European anthem says "Europe is united now, united it may remain".

This nonsense does not only target France, it targets Europe entirely.

I wish China good luck on its path to total isolation. Bar a few African countries and North Korea.

@E,

God knows where you are from, if it necessary, maybe you can come from Mars. Just like you dear CNN or BBC,
they can make fake news and copy pic from Nepal just call it from Tibet and cut pic what the chinese police save people call they arrested people.

Hello 赵破奴, you stupid fucking bastard.

I'd usually black out at least one letter from the above vulgarities, but I will make this fucking exception for you.

Please enlighten me, you fool: Which is my country?

According to my birth cert, and passport, I come from the Republic of Ireland, which, according to my history books, was neutral during WWII. The insignificant island actually still is. You should have paraded your f-cking torch thru Dublin.

You say in a comment above that you are "an ordinary Chinese person". You are not - you are a dumb fuck.

Oh, yeah. You wanna give me some kindness now (for this "injury"? Then suck my fucking cock.

Hahaha, good acting, whatever who you are, now everyone in the world who is really love peace and kindness are all know who you are...

I feel better now, and I will not wast my time on this small-time blogs anymore, thank you and I like you. :)

fuck Britain i like Ireland

Balboa! DO NOT SPEAK DIRTY WORDS ANYMORE !
ALL THE PEOPLE OF THE WORLD LOOK DOWN ON YOU!
BARBARIAN MAN!
MAY I ASK YOU A QUESTION:WHAT IS EAST INDIA COMPANY OF U.K?

Balboa! DO NOT SPEAK DIRTY WORDS ANYMORE !
ALL THE PEOPLE OF THE WORLD LOOK DOWN ON YOU!
BARBARIAN MAN!
MAY I ASK YOU A QUESTION:WHAT IS EAST INDIA COMPANY OF U.K?

As I know, EAST INDIA COMPANY WAS GOOD AT ROBBING TREASURE FROM OTHER COUNTRY.

Oh, Scrooge, I do apologize if I have hurt your feelings. Like I said in my post above, I would usually block out some of the letters when using vulgarities to emphasize a point, but I decided to type those words in full on that occasion. I was being accused of starting the Korean War/wanting to start WWIII!!?? I can assure you that I do not.

Watch out.

The barbarians are out to destroy China.

Once again!

Jim,
I like how you defined your terms to present a clear picture of what some of the matters at hand are really about. Your definition of “nationalism” fits exactly with my understanding and experience of what it is suggested by the demagogues of what it means to be American—to be vigorously right in all matters international, and domestically to be on the watch for anyone who disagrees with this rightness at home or abroad. Personally, I have always found this kind of thing distasteful and terribly misguided.

As a derivative country, which except for Native Americans and descendants of African slaves (and that is a whole other heartbreaking matter), the U.S. has been built from the physical and mental labor of immigrant peoples from all around the globe. And so, for the U.S. to adopt an attitude of superiority to other nations--when in fact a great debt is owed to the people from these other nations--reeks of ingratitude, chauvinism, and a terribly misguided approach to getting along in a global culture.

What you point out too about the selective use of such loaded words as "patriotism" and "nationalism" (and the subtle and not so subtle ways language conditions attitudes and prejudices) is wise and astute. The manufacturing of the concept “yellow peril,” or rather the fear of and anger against the Chinese that U.S. powerbrokers historically incited against the Chinese at times when their labor (physical or mental) was no longer needed or wanted, is despicable. Jewish people should feel a kinship with the Chinese on this point, as noxious publications such as The Elders of Zion were written to whip-up a similar kind of fear and anger towards the Jews. Isn’t it heartbreakingly ironic that both the Jews and the Chinese were victims of brutal and barbaric holocausts at approximately the same time in history?

It’s disturbing and yet terribly characteristic to see the double standard concerning the use of language to describe and define things. Words are powerful tools not only because they shape consciousness, attitude, and opinion but because in a media-driven society such as we have in the U.S., these words become for some the unquestioned reality where what is said or presented about something is of more importance than the actual reality of that thing. This Power Point (on YouTube) seems to make this point as well:

Age-Old Racism Towards Chinese Lives On (YouTube)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=79pEC7-6uN4

On another note, I like how you handled that guy Paul--by letting loose with some Caffertyisms. As an Irish (and French) American woman I am reminded of how the “paddy wagons” got their name--from the “Paddys” (nickname of men named Patrick) Irishmen who were rounded up as “goons,” “riff raff,” “thugs,” “n-----“ when their labor and presence was no longer needed or wanted. “Irish go home” and “Irish need not apply” were commonly seen and heard at those times. For all the prejudice they initially experienced in the U.S., the Irish (probably owing to their being white and Christian) did not suffer from such despicable laws such as the Chinese Exclusion Act. It’s amazing how so many Americans today can be so ignorant of this country’s own history and how that history has been frequently at odds with what it is supposed to stand for and uphold (justice, liberty, equality under the law for all).

I really like too how you captured the sound and image of a barnyard or Orwell’s Animal Farm. You had me howling with the pig grunts. I’m born year of the dog :) woof, woof. On a similar note, the parrots (“parroting”)? Are they the Mexican “day laborers” who I assume are neither insured nor compensated for injuries while working for low wages to the benefit of American homeowners? And are these homeowners the same group of voters who get their ire aroused at election time and want to deny this group of workers health care and their children education, yet appreciate getting low cost lawn and leaf care? I would like to know about the safety of that equipment that those men strap to their backs, the possible hazards to health (and hearing) caused by those loud vibrating machines—both the short-term and long-term effects, and why American homeowners who benefit from low-cost Mexican labor aren’t paying what employers are supposed to (money toward the workers’ Social Security, unemployment insurance, health insurance, sick leave and so on).

I can just imagine the “anti-American” accusations that will likely be hurled in my direction for saying all this; but I will end by saying that with freedom comes responsibility and that no one is truly free until all are.

. . .
This we know: the earth does not belong to man, man belongs to the earth. All things are connected like the blood that unites us all. Man did not weave the web of life, he is merely a strand in it. Whatever he does to the web, he does to himself.
. . .
~Chief Seattle
http://www.barefootsworld.net/seattle.html